Some (comparative) notes on the situation of Filipino Youth
| With a population of almost 90 million, the It is likely that this trend is going to continue in the years to come. The country’s population growth rate is a dynamic 1.8% ( Predominantly Roman Catholic, religion traditionally plays a big role in Philippine affairs. Catholic and some A nation-wide survey in 1996 conducted among Filipino youth respondents with ages ranging from 15-30 found out the following: 87% consider themselves religious; 69% describe themselves as going to church at least once a week, if not more; about six in seven of the youth interviewed pray at least once a day. Contrast that to the recent (2006) Shell study on German youth (ages: 12-25) that found out that only 30% of the respondents believe in a personal God and that a big portion (65%) of the German youth interviewed don’t believe that the Church have the answers to questions that concern today’s young people. Religion aside, the 1996 Filipino youth survey and the recent Shell Study contained interesting similarities: both youth groups put great importance on family and education. In the Shell Study cited, researchers found out that a big majority (72%) of the German youth believe that one needs a family in order to be happy. In the Filipino survey, 98% of youth respondents said it is very important for them having a good marriage and family life. But how are these two institutions coping in both societies? The answers are not so encouraging. Under varying social pressure, German families suffer from a high rate of divorce (every 3rd of German marriages break up) and the increasing phenomenon of “patchwork” families. On the other hand, owing to economic difficulties at home, many Filipino families have to endure long physical separation as mothers and fathers—estimated between 8-10 million- are forced to work overseas to earn their living. Another common finding is the youth’s attitude towards education. Both youth groups look up to education as very important in order to be able to survive in this increasingly globalising, highly competitive world. Whereas German youth are concerned about diminishing job trainings and a school system which performance, according to Be that as it may, Unfortunately such is not the case in the Despite contrary claims, Filipino politicians don’t see education as their top priority. The government spends only 12% of its budget on education which is quite low, even in comparison with its poorer neighbours like With this neglect, it is not a wonder that as many as 10% of Filipino children don’t have access to schools; only 68% finish elementary grades; 42% finish high school; and a paltry 14% get college degrees. If Germans were shocked to know about their PISA ranking (No. 18 in Math, No. 21 in reading, and No. 22 in Science), Filipino politicians couldn’t care less about the country’s more dismal performance. The In science, only 7% of senior high school students (more or less equivalent to Even in English, the lingua franca of world business, and a language Filipinos used to be at home with, only 7 per cent of its senior students had command of it. So not much chance for the “ Although young Filipinos are known worldwide as techno savvies (“world champions” of “texting” or sending short messages through mobile phones), they are left behind in information and computer technology (ICT). Only a tiny minority (2-7%) of college graduates land job in this highly lucrative field. With high unemployment rate, even young college graduates couldn’t find employment so their only chance to find decent work is overseas. Filipino authorities estimate that there are about 3,100 Filipinos who leave daily to seek or occupy overseas positions. Many of those leaving are young doctors and nurses, badly affecting the country’s health system where there’s only one doctor care for between 10,000 and 26,000 patients. The situation has become absurd. Since nurses are more in demand abroad than doctors, Filipino doctors are applying for work as nurses- about 5000 of them in 2004 alone. Last year, an estimated 4000 young doctors are taking up nursing, leaving many hospitals in the country short of doctors. When the survey was taken ten years ago, the country was relatively economically and politically stable, and the youth not only felt very proud to be Filipino, they were also generally happy about their situation. A lot of things have changed – many consider, for worse - since then, so the question now if young Filipinos are satisfied with their situation now? If the frequent massive political rallies and demonstrations- many of them spearheaded by the youth and students all over the country- against President Macapagal Arroyo are any indication, they are not. Like their counterpart during Martial Law years, the Filipino youth are now also clamouring for change. If the country’s political, economic, and cultural institutions are willing to listen to their calls for a better future, is another big question. | Youth Statistics Religious influence Shell Study Similar Aspirations Importance of Family life Family realities Education as chance in globalising world Brain drain Proud to be Filipino Challenge to Filipino leaders |
80 Kommentare:
Hi, I wrote this actually last October for for the German-Philippine Ecumenical Conference. But the issues raised are still relevant..
"Even in English, the lingua franca of world business, and a language Filipinos used to be at home with, only 7 per cent of its senior students had command of it. So not much chance for the “Call Centers” or “back offices” like the ones now fuelling English-speaking India to progress."
There are granularities to this that you need to appreciate. I was in india for a fellowship and their percentage of english speakers is probably lower than us. they do hire lots of call center agents but its because there are just too many indians. as percentage to population, there are more english speakers here in RP. and percentage-wise to population, there are more pinoys working in cyberservices than in india.
"The situation has become absurd. Since nurses are more in demand abroad than doctors, Filipino doctors are applying for work as nurses- about 5000 of them in 2004 alone. Last year, an estimated 4000 young doctors are taking up nursing, leaving many hospitals in the country short of doctors."
its the pull of economics and its a personal decision (if you believe on personal agency) and therefore not absurd. people make decisions and i usually respect it when they do. the recent trend though these days is that the perceived scarcity of doctors has started to make private practice more rewarding thus a doc friend of mine has decided not to leave. and there's a rise in enrolment of med students lately with med schools offering lots of scholarships. there's a positive side to it as well.
"3,100 Filipinos who leave daily to seek or occupy overseas positions. Many of those leaving are young doctors and nurses, badly affecting the country’s health system where there’s only one doctor care for between 10,000 and 26,000 patients."
these people leave because of the inequities in the health system, not the other way around. many of these hospitals are mismanaged, with doctors and nurses underpaid. now, that lots of nurses and doctors are leaving, their services are getting to be perceived as important, hence their wages are improving a bit. they are leaving because they have been abused for so long. before, the pay of doc is just about P17,000 even lower than a journalist's pay. the nurses get P6000, lower than the security guard.
now hospitals are starting to appreciate their services.
"In science, only 7% of senior high school students (more or less equivalent to Germany’s 10th class) had mastered it."
interesting. there's a recent world math olympiad in china. out of 40 medals, the philippines got 14, the rest mostly by asians. we didnt hear much from europeans. but yeah, on average, europeans are ok.
God, what do i got here, i should stick to my poetry! but yes, i believe in personal agency, where a person decides and acts what is best for him, but it doesn't hide the fact that a pinoy doctor would study nursing just to be able to work abroad, leaving many of our hospitals undermanned. Cuba is a smaller and poorer country than ours, but they do have better medical care than ours- not to mention a better emergency response for storms and other calamities.
"With high unemployment rate, even young college graduates couldn’t find employment so their only chance to find decent work is overseas."
what's the jobless rate of germany? the philippines has 7.4 percent based on ILO definiton. but that's not my point.
re overseas jobs, this is how it works: deployment these days are declining but the remittances are rising. it means we are increasingly posting the skilled ones, with higher pay. so increasingly, those who get jobs abroad were employed here, meaning that increasingly we are seeing the dynamics of labor market globalization at work. good or bad, lets see. certainly its good for our friend bong.
but cuba is communist. wait til Fidel is dead. but yes, the cubans are good in so many things including organic agriculture.
Another thing, it's not the personal agency that I'm questioning, its the macro policies of our government that led hundreds of our doctors to eat their pride to study nursing to be able to work to work abroad to provide a decent income for their families back home.
they have always been undermanned, jack. and increasingly so when returns for other professions like IT, engineering, and other sciences have started to rise. and more so when suddenly, the europeans and the americans realized they lack doctors and opened the flood gates for our nurses. but dont worry, the numbers have started improving lately.
yeah, macro policy is bad. that's true. but there's a pull factor, which is the demographic change in europe, japan, australia, new zealand, and the US. those guys need our med professionals also jack. they are getting old and they need the care that they need. they are humans too.
dave, i'm also through with "isms", what i want are results. i don't care what isms i live now so long as i know that my family has food to eat, are taken cared of where there are typhoons or earthquakes, and that i have a competent doctor i can go to when i get sick, and of course some degree of freedom- only some, the rest i can give up for security's sake
sure, they need our doctors, but not at our expense. you live in manila where medical care is better than the rest of the country. i was a province boy dave and knew first hand how difficult it is to get a damn good medical service.
sure, no worries, as the aussies would say.
access to doc is a function of income and social security systems, etc. so its complicated. but the docs and nurses have their aspirations too. why should society deprive them that?
besides, higher demand for them sends market signals to these professions, thus attracting more enrolments, as is happening right now. and in reality, only few of them are going to leave for various reasons, including the rise in local pays, love, culture, and overall friction of distance.
so dont worry, you will have your doctors here. will not run out of doctors.
preventing them from leaving wont solve the problem. the solution lies elsewhere.
The idea about a “medical crisis,” of many people going back to their Maker without seeing a doctor, is real. That crisis has long been there even before media’s stories about doctors and nurses leaving for a better life abroad became fashionable. At the root of this problem is poverty that is preventing sick people from availing of hospitals’ services. It’s also a crisis of governance, or the government’s failure to provide health care either through investments in this vital social infrastructure or a universal health insurance system. It’s definitely a crisis of career because for a long time, nurses have long been treated like slaves, logging in long working hours yet getting meager wages: P5000-6000 (US$90-110) dollars a month. That amount is only half the teachers’ or the cop’s salaries.
These problems are the ones driving the medical personnel abroad. Of course, there are pull factors as well. When the Americans, Europeans, and Japan started to realize there are not enough people to care for their aging population they knew they only have to call Manila to solve their problem. These countries put their money where their heart is by paying decent dollars to our nurses and caregivers. In the Philippines, these professionals are nothing but glamorous peons in white who are commanded to care only for those who can afford to pay the bills.
Solution? Leave the nurses, or the doctors who became nurses, alone. Let them go to where their services are appreciated a lot more. The fear that their departure will send most local hospitals falling like dominoes is hogwash. Those hospitals that collapsed did probably because of management failures or a combination of many other reasons and not because a nurse or two have resigned and left to pursue their dreams. And when the nurses indeed leave, local pay for nurses and doctors could possibly rise to a point where many would probably be enticed to stay. That’s what market forces can do. It’s possible that the cost of health care will probably rise but that’s what you get for giving the nurses their dignity.
pardon my rant, jack. we are just discussing here. not quarreling. hahahah!
interesting, but got to go shopping, so you'll get the last word on this. For now!
ok.
And while the nurses and doctors leave, let the government fix the health care system maybe by expanding health insurance coverage or investing in more health care facilities. Let the local government units, probably at the provincial level, set up provincial hospitals based on their own financial capability. That’s one of their mandates under the Local Government Code anyway. And let the private sector, the civil society do their shares. Policy makers may also consider deregulating the health insurance industry to allow greater competition. Why not allow foreign health insurance companies to come in and offer their services?
If Filipinos can afford to enrich Globe Telecom and Smart Communications to the tune of P10-20 billions net after tax each year, surely they can afford to pay more for health care. Let’s face it: even “poor” people in urban poor communities—nay slums or squatters’ colonies—burn their money in cigarettes, liquor, and gambling (e.g. jueteng, masiao, sakla, cock fighting) all day while waiting for their spouse to bring home the bacon.
ill keep on ranting here. hahahaha!
Solving the medical crisis therefore is a struggle that will be won over several generations. It’s a struggle that could only be won in tandem with other crucial reforms, specifically fiscal reforms. This struggle, of course, will be a lot easier if the country could attain high (i.e. 6-7 percent growth in gross domestic product), consistent, and job-creating economic growth for a decade or two. That’s what China is doing and it’s achieving great strides in poverty alleviation and health care.
"With this neglect, it is not a wonder that as many as 10% of Filipino children don’t have access to schools; only 68% finish elementary grades; 42% finish high school; and a paltry 14% get college degrees."
In India, only about ten percent gets up to college. Im not disparaging the Indians. but im just putting the context, just in case we think we are the lousiest creatures on earth. lol!
"If the frequent massive political rallies and demonstrations- many of them spearheaded by the youth and students all over the country- against President Macapagal Arroyo are any indication, they are not. Like their counterpart during Martial Law years, the Filipino youth are now also clamouring for change."
the youth in almost all societies are always clamoring for change.. that seems to be their role in the advancement of societies. but demonstrations per se are a lot smaller now, maybe because many of them could somehow get jobs in the new growth drivers of the economy: cyber services, electronics, minings, finance, trade, overseas work, medicine, among many others.
but i agree with you; we still have a long way to go.
"If the country’s political, economic, and cultural institutions are willing to listen to their calls for a better future, is another big question."
we share the same frustrations. but i could see we are living in a totally different world. change these days are increasingly driven by the "revolution from beyond" and local institutions cant help but respond or unravel.
thanks for the opportunity to comment on these things.
Interesting to see a comparison from someone who's got inside information from two countries (another thing shared).
35% of the population being children is VERY high, and so is the population's growth rate. I wonder if these aren't the basic problems.
From what I've seen (and read) of Asian education: it is highly competitive. European education tends to focus on cooperation and on learning how to learn. I wouldn't worry over-much about "only average performances"; the kids are probably good at what interests them while just getting by in the rest - but they'll know how to catch up when they feel they need/want to. This won't happen in India where learning is - bluntly put, please excuse - parrot-blabbering. How is it in the Philippines?
its a serious problem in the philippines as well, in general. but there are on-going reforms manifested in the rise of science high schools. rote learning is supposedly common among Asian countries, and its quite true in the philippines as well.
Thanks - I'm glad to hear of the reforms.
I still remember my niece's tutor - my niece is 5 - worries when she was ONLY no. 8 out of forty-odd in some test. If he'd said that in Danish TV, six million people would have laughed themselves to death. That's one reason why you don't hear much of Europeans in a Chinese contest, Dave (another being that it's in China :-). Education is not about being better than the next guy/gal, it's about doing your own best.
i see your point there, thanks. the americans also sent their kids, trained for a year by harvard mathwhiz professors. they didnt beat the asians. but i guess that's another story. and its not really a good determinant of what is good education. i agree.
OK. Then the doctors: finding a doctor in India is more than easy, but finding a GOOD doctor is like the famous needle in the haystack. They go abroad because the pay is higher and because local hospitals are a mess. All right, not all of them, of course. But why is it so difficult to find a good GP? They don't need to worry about messy hospitals, and they earn good money here. D'you have a similar problem? The cause?
similar story. its because the good ones do their practice in the cities where they make good money. since the 90s, the national govt "decentralized" provincial hospitals to provincial governments that are usually short of funds. with low pay, many doctors ended up practicing in private hospitals in the cities, that are unaffordable generally to the poorest of the poor. some left for work abroad (US).
but what i was saying to jack is that preventing medical professionals to leave wont solve it. its a complicated issue.
No - you can't forbid people to leave, of course. Perhaps encouraging them to stay, e.g. by offering low-interest loans to those who want to open private clinics (in provinces) provided they stay for x years? But they have to be able to survive on it. Yeah - complicated!
actually, we had "doctors for the villages" program here and there are actually lots of young idealistic doctors who are willing so serve. but we need to expand the program.
also, because of the perceive scarcity of doctors these days, hospitals are now paying their doctors relatively better pay. local practice now has started to be economically viable for many doctors.
of course not, civilized people esp. if the're friends don't quarrel, they don't even argue with one another. They converse, instead. So you enjoy this conversation sonof...lol
A caveat on that unemployment rate: we had 25% in some areas for graduates in the Humanities back in the 70es, but then: if you reject all other jobs than Uni or high school teacher and you won't leave Copenhagen, you'll statistically speaking be a receiver of unemployment compensation - but that may not say much about the number of jobs in Denmark.
dave, did you ever pose a moment about the social consequences of this solution? I was hospitalized in Cagayan de Oro for 3 days during my last vacation there (ha, that's another good story for cross- and intercultural insights, but that will come later) and I know what state their services appear to be. Nevertheless, if they all go bancrupt because of lack of competent doctors and nurses, where will the people go? May I remind you of the constitutional duty of the state to provide basic health services to their citizens (and hospitals are basic, dave), too much reliance on the market forces can be dangerous! The same is true with personal agency, as the Americans found out after Katrina.
Are you saying that my ailing mother would have to die because her doctor, the only competent one in the area left to work as nurse in the US, before the government would fix the problems? Okey, this is a little bit mellow dramatic, but you get the drift?
Or your ailing mother has to die because the cost of treatment unfortunately went up so that nurses can have their dignity?
YES - it's the duty of the state to provide health care to desperately poor as well as rich. The SAME care! Market economy doesn't ensure this.
I agree with you India is by all accounts has worse structural problems than what we have. But it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a peep at our neighbor's backyard. And, never in my whole life abroad was I ashamed where I came from- poverty, man-made and natural disasters and all.
you are most welcome, my friend, more than ever you are a worthy (intellectual) adversary.
thanks for dropping in here, Ulla, I find it fascinating to note the difference between the German and the Filipino school system. But it is disappointing to note that the European- okey, I mean German- educational system is going back to elitism. Budget for education is getting scarce once again- or better said, at the bottom of it priorities- so the tendency now is- instead of democratically spreading resources- the trick now is just to concentrate resources on a few bright students in special gymnasiums called internat (something like the science high concept in the Philippines, where gifted students concentrate and given special kind of privileges). And since, in many cases, intelligence is also a social product, if you come from a migrant background child living in a ghetto, chances are you end up after the required primary education in the so-called "Hauptschule" where student-teacher ratio is very high and facilities are often sub-standard.
apropos migrants in Germany, I'm going to post another paper I wrote. of course, I'll be again honored to welcome your critiques and comments.
sorry, Ulla, I won't post it here because it is in German (I thought I wrote it in English!) but if you are interested I'll send it to you. Or if you can wait for my German blog :-)
Ah - the elitism. I'm out of touch, but I don't think it can/will be done in Scandinavia; it's against our national character.
What is Internat - semi-private? Or fully government funded?
That intelligence is a social product is a very good observation. I sometimes think: if I die, where will my little niece (my almost-daughter) be? My family are illiterates, and no matter how much money they spend on her school, it won't do it alone. Without me, she wouldn't even have known before she started school that books are to be read - for pleasure.
Where are you going to blog in German? If I need to sign up somewhere to read it, it's better you mail it. My mail address is in my profile, visible to contacts. I'd rather not write it here if you don't mind.
Or you could just copy it into a PM, I guess. That German blog seems to be a bit iffy. He he.
of course they would, but the government has to provide the legal infra to let them do it.
an internat is like a boarding school. They are funded, like most schools here, with tax paywers money. Personally, I also have a problem with this trend. My 9-year old daughter is supposedly highly gifted but the normal grade school can't give her better chances to explore her talents. She really suffered a lot trying to be just an average pupil in the last 3 years and the teacher told us that she couldn't do more for her bec the majority of her classmates (27 all in all in the class) also have their own needs (i.e. slower phase of learning). Now the state tried to solve the problem by making a pilot project for all so-called gifted pupils in the area and make a special project where they can meet every once a week. My wife and I at first argued, that the best solution would have been to hire another teacher to help out in the class- Anna at first didn't want to be pulled out in her class (even if it is only once a week(!) bec. somehow to be tagged "special child" here carries a kind of stigma- but you know to hire another teacher to work full time would be much more expensive than just reorganizing the workload of the present teachers. As you very well know, financial arguments always trump libertarian ideals of democracy and equality for all.
Yeah - sigh. They increase the work load of the teachers, the latter get less time for preparation and less energy in general, their teaching suffers, ---. But we saved money - hooray!
27 are definitely too many for one teacher.
I don't see that Anna's problem is being solved either. OK, she gets some challenges etc. once a week, but she's still being bored to tears four days a week. Makeshift solution.
How many kids do you have, Jack? Any photos of them?
wow!!! what i got here. hmmm, i still have to finish an editorial but ill definitely answer all these. hahah!
hmmm, you still nurture that idea that government could really define national interest. it cannot. im enough big states. blame, amartya sen for this view, jack. i really am in this thought that development is all about choices. that development is freedom. and in this globalized world, going anywhere to find happiness is part of that. borders has become obsolete.
having said that, take taiwan, israel, ireland, india, and china. they are all developed or fast developing. the reason? its all about their best minds in the sciences going to the silicon valley, studying there, working there, and marinated there (in both cultural and business sense). when their local economies started to show promise, many of these best minds either returned to set up shop (electronics, IT, biotech, etc), many became links or bridges for business between silicon valley and their countries, and many fly in and out as consultant and experts on so many things (IT, semiconductors, medicine, biotech, defense tech, etc). the result? the acceleration of growth and development in these countries.
now after sending their experts to silicon valley, the indians and the chinese are reaping the harvests.
do you know how annalee saxenian, the famour researcher of this trend, call this trend? its called "brain circulation." so the thinking now has evolved from "brain drain" to brain circulation, benefitting both the US and the rest of the world. [(oh my, i have a two-hour discussion of this topic with annalee saxenian herself at the university of california; that was a great experience). yabang ano? i tell you this because we are friends, hehehe.]
that too could happen in the philippines. we should not really worry about brain drain; the flipside to that is brain gain and brain circulation.
i exactly know what you mean. leave or no leave for abroad, your grandma will die if Philippine society, nay hospital owners and the government, continue to treat doctors and nurses like trash. you invested millions to become a doctor or a nurse, then all you get is a pay lower that what a journalist gets? that's injustice, to say the least.
my other point is, we should allow market forces to work where it can work for the best while complimenting it with other measures.
on elitism..., ah, the germans are learning from the silicon valley where kids who are competitive ended transforming the world with their new business procedures, new gadgets, new technology. google, yahoo, the internet, the PC clones, you tube, HP, electronics, you name every socially-transforming new things and intellectual properties and they all come from school systems that breeds competitively smart kids. japan is reforming its system towards that end, china, india, and now germany. americans of course are saying their school system is deteriorating and are scrambling to find the answers. but hey, every country in this world is saying its educ system is getting bad, and i guess its because globalization is demanding a new breed of knowledge workers and the school system is lagging behind.
well, alvin toffler has discussed it in his recent work "revolutionary wealth." grab a copy there. nice reading.
the real danger is when you forget your social safety nets. there's nothing wrong with "elitism" per se, for as long as every body has the equal chance to shine. hey, not every body could be bill gates, but others become michael jordan, or maria sharapova, while others are happy just being in the bleacher watching the show while waiting for the latest info a a new exciting deal.
that's a nice jargon she has there, dave, but let's be honest, just like capital, it is less of a circulation than a "concentration". Germany for one has been producing- through tax-payer's money, may i remind you- world-class scientists whom head-hunters mainly from the US lure to have post-doc studies there, offer salaries 3X as high as they can get here- since taxes there are not as high as in Germany. and don't come back anymore. Of course, many Indians, Israelis from the US and other western country's are now going back ("re-migrating") to their own countries but try to see what their goverments provided to lure them back and to have their "homecoming" a little bit more pleasant, aside from appealing to their national pride.
of course, see my photos in my site.
let me make this point clear: i never argue that we live detacthed from the rest of the world like the north koreans do. And since you mentioned Ireland, the celtic tiger in europe would still be until now a rural puppy without the massive infusion of cash (ok, capital) as incentive for joining the EU, which they in turn invested, wisely, I should add, to education and to incentives luring (lower taxes, lower wages) many start up companies. Btw, the Republic of Ireland has been booming long before the Black Friday Agreement with the IRAs. But yes Northern Ireland is now catching up as well. So what I am saying is: it is not only the market forces that at play here. A nation if it is to survive has to have a VISION. And from this vision should emanate the policies that our state would defend, cajole others nations, and maybe compromise but not to the extent that it would totally diminish this thing. Now tell me, what is the vision of GMA? And is she up to the task of asserting it in the world stage or she's only up to its pa-cute photo ops?
I know. The other solution the teacher suggested to us is to send her to the international school nearby: max. 15 pupils per class, intensive tutorial, and the language is English (mainly for children of expat managers and NATO top brass). It would cost us 600 Euros a month... no Pinoy migrant here could afford that. Besides, we've heard teaching there is not that great... probably british or american style...
btw, will send you my german article and see what you'd say...
hay jack, you are so old fashioned, hahahah! kidding.
that's true. vision is important. but what do you do when local elites dont have it?
then you rely on your "revolution from beyond," the dynamics of the market, competitive pressures from the global market place to shape local conditions. the truth is that the dynamics of the Philippine economy has somehow decoupled from politics to that extent that the economy could grow despite GMA and her like. the new growth drivers emerge almost spontaneously.
in reality, success stories in the US (say silicon valley) or elsewhere came from those that were not really planned. but the conditions simply emerged due to convergence of certain factors, like migration of talents, good infra, good weather, the presence of universities, entrepreneurial talent, venture capital, etc. what im saying is that one could develop and grow without grand visions from politicians. or maybe im just a hopeless optimist?
seems like we re debating the role of the state here.hehheh!
you may view http://davidllorito.blogspot.com/2007/06/globalization-as-stabilizing-force-in.html. re "revolution from beyond."
dave, dave, dave... I'll love you for this comment! But true, either I'm still a closet - or worse, an unrecontructed- Marxist or that you've become a free market purist, nay, fanatic. Now, beat that... LOL
that's a false dichotomy. in reality, a country doesnt run out of doctors and nurses. when these people leave, their services become scarce, thus giving incentives for more local people to take the profession. and not all of them are going to leave. hence, the grandma wouldnt die since there would always be nurses and doctors to take their place. migration actually promotes social mobility.
take that from someone who has resisted all the temptations to migrate. lol!
could be neither. in economics and political science, there's a constant debate on the role of the state under varying conditions and those debating are neither marxists or market fundamentalists. neither am i.
want me to tell you my favorite economic philosopher? its amartya sen, and he is neither marxist nor free markeeter.
but neither am I "old fashioned", buddy. I'm cultured, dave, not old fashioned... and please note the difference LOL
my apologies, my friend. from the bottom of my heart. yeah, cultured is the right term. amen.
No. It isn't a dichotomy at all. It is simply what may happen (and sometimes does) when a society tries to solve one not-too-difficult problem without seeing it as part of a whole.
India has free government schools (books and uniforms aren't free, but never mind that now). As my husband once explained to a tourist in words of max two syllables: roast chicken don't fly into the students' mouths on their way home from school. Zahoor himself was sent away to work when he was about 11 because his three small sisters had to eat.
You pay doctors and nurses enough for them to have a decent life - a very good thing in itself. But it's the patients who have to cover the expenses, and many of them can't afford the now higher price. As far as they are concerned, the doctors might as well be sitting in Boston. The problem isn't solved, it just LOOKS solved.
I already covered in this scenario in previous comments. So ill move forward. All these things is a problem of development or lack of it. Lack of access to health services is not just about doctors staying, but about incomes as well, hence economic growth is important. Second, we could address lack of doctors by lowering barriers to entry to the medical profession by scholarships, etc, which are happening right now, but not restricting foreign deployment. Factors like expanded health coverage could also help address the issue.
I think I'd start with the health coverage, Dave. Back to "it's the state's responsibility to ---".
Economic growth doesn't help if resources stay on few hands. Then it increases the gap between classes.
hey, dave, I'm not yet through with you on this one. it could be true that there are enough doctors, if you'll look at the big picture. but in reality, they are concentrated in manila or cebu and other big urban centers but how about the rural areas? I've read somewhere that even a big university hospital like that in Silliman in Dumaguete is in danger of closing because doctors are leaving or only working part-time because they're studying at daytime nursing. That's very absurd!
looks absurd to you. but its looks "natural" to me, in the sense that people are exercising their freedom to pursue their own happiness. they are exercising their choice. of course, this one is also in response to some global demographic change, and change could sometimes be painful and disruptive either at personal or societal levels.
the state certainly has to provide services for its citizens, but under this new reality, what could it do? what are the policy options? one is cuba option where they put limits to the mobility of their citizens. another is for the government to raise pay of local doctors and nurses, plus some sort of human resource development programs. and third is allowing the market forces to work.
the cuban option is certainly a no no. by the looks of it, joma is a goner.
a combination of second and third option is what is taking place in the philippines right now. but the migration of medical professionals are driven by market and demographic forces hence state response are always behind. you cant beat the market on that one. what i could see in the future is the possibility that the supply of docs and nurses will reach an equilibrium given the fact that the rest of the world could only absorb so much.
supposing, one day the world runs out of journalists and political scientists. should the state stop me from leaving? if the state stops me, then there are no reason for the younger generation to take up journalism and pol sci because there is no economic incentive to do so.
whether or not incomes and wealth are not well distributed, you still need sustained growth of the economy so that the state could collect enough resources to finance health and other social infrastructure like education. of course, it helps a lot when society is more equitable.
it should become society's strategic goal, dave, not just wishful thinking. germany didn't become what it is today without all those "redistributive" policies of the social democrats under willy brandt in early '70's- a policy which actually preserves social peace and more productivity until now. (the germans are two years in a row now export world master, despite criticisms of high unemployment rate and sturdy bureaucracy! )
I don't really need to have explained that if I have three kids and only just enough money to feed and clothe them, I don't have to worry about fair pocket money. I know I don't get economy, Dave, but I'm not that bad.
What pisses me off are the kind of parents who have enough to feed and clothe the kids plus money for cigarettes and whiskey and wild wild whatevers and still don't give their kids pocket money. If you get my drift.
indeed, a fair society is ultimately the goal. no one denies that. the discussion here is really how to get to that goal. im still into this growth with equity thing, meaning that you should attain growth while doing redistributive measures. how to do that is quite tricky and sometimes its imperative that you let competitive pressures in to shake the local oligarchy. its because of president ramos' deregulation and market competition policies that we are able to have modern telecom industry whose benefit reaches down to the poorest of the poor. that's just one example.
amen to this point of view.
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